Posted On: Saturday - July 22nd 2023 10:40AM MST
In Topics: Americans The Future
Part 1 on this topic, written yesterday, had observations only. The explanations are myriad and arguable as to significance, but the demise of American cities IS a thing, one we can all observe if we have memories of only a decade or two back.
Let's go back more than that, to before my memories of the world, to the flight from cities to suburbs. Of course, the automobile and the interstate highway system (meant for yes, inter-state but spurs and loops ended up serving city/suburb travel as much as interstate travel) made it easier for American to have their own "spreads", even if only 1/2 an acre. One fact in this flight I did not understand myself until fairly recently, from my reading of certain non-Narrative-based (or just "based") blogs, is the racial aspect. Going back 1/2 a century it was mostly White flight, not everybody. The reasons for this are likely known to the Peak Stupidity crowd, so I won't belabor the point of getting the hell away from Black! violence and theft.
I can still remember a department store in the downtown of a medium-sized city I know well. It was there in the early 1980s, but, as I recall, just closing down. Yeah, the malls drew the shoppers - think Breakfast at Tiffany's (the movie, not the song) - away from the city, but that seems like a chicken/egg question. Were the malls successful because people already lived outside the cities and needed to drive to shop anyway? Or, were they built because the inner city shopping experience became "not so great" due to the same factor that drove White residents away.
Well, that's the long past. Because medium-sized cities had* government offices one might need to go to, the banks, etc. there was a reason to occasionally go downtown. Then too, there were the office workers. They went to lunch at various establishments near them downtown and had to do errands too. So, downtown was kind of fun - except for parking, about which I could write a book of humorous anecdotes! - during the daytime. At night, unless you were a partying university student, you got the hell out. It got dark and quiet, way too quiet.
Then what? I was pretty late in noticing, so I imagine the trend of lots of housing being built in America's inner cities was happening 5 years or more before I noticed it ~ 2 decades ago. You all have seen the types of buildings. (I didn't see any of this in Hartford that day, but I didn't get around all of downtown.) Those pricey 5 story condo buildings with their coffee shops in the loft-style lobby are not my style, but I don't begrudge the young people for wanting to leave those Sub-divisions for the Bright Lights, Big City** Before these residences, I'd seen huge old brick mill buildings get converted into apartments too. Either way, gentrification, the ousting of ghetto dwellers via razing of old dwellings and the construction of these newer buildings (also the pastel row-house thing), made these parts of the cities safer to live in over a 30 year span or so.
That sounded great then. You can live right there downtown near your job where all the conveniences are and party at night with other young people. They've got the blocked off walk streets for craft beer festivals, and other stuff, which I'll mention at the end...
That one block section, with that fancy clothing store at one corner, was blocked to cars.
The thing is though, as of late, as there are more places to live in them. the cities themselves are no longer all they've been cracked up to be.
I've got to back up here. A factor making cities less pleasant is the slow but sure increase in the number of street people, homeless and/or bums. There've always been the down-on-their-luck, the Wharf Rats, as described nicely by the Grateful Dead (Robert Hunter, to be fair). The situation nowadays involves more than a few established bums and grifters. A factor in the demise of the cities has been the demise of the Funny Farm. See Peak Stupidity on Outsourcing of the Funny Farms and All flew out of the Cuckoo's Nest - an Unforced Error? ***
There's a political aspect to this, and, as usual, the cities of the West coast more than tolerate the mess, and even have encouraged it. The good weather also makes the cities there a haven for the homeless. (Were I homeless, I'd choose San Diego, but I don't know if they'd have ME.) The situation is worse almost everywhere though.
That's a long-term deterioration that could be dealt with. Another is the more recent politically-caused crime wave, motivated by the "Summer of George". This goes back closer to 10 years though, and it's gotten to the point where Black! city dwellers can get away with anything, making things more miserable for everybody. Steve Sailer is all over this, so I don't need to expound much.
All of that damage to American cities might be overcome with political will, of which there is none. The future keeps coming though, and it's the internet that has been part of what could be the permanent demise. The Kung Flu PanicFest consisted of experiments in Totalitarianism, for the most part, but along with those were the experiments in a UBI (Univeral Basic Income)****, which didn't go well at all and also remote work via the internet.
Lots of that white-collar work can be done from home. Is there a reason for big office buildings at all anymore? In the comments under the previous post, Mr. Blanc mentioned that management may not always like this idea. The concept of "hours worked" would have to be changed in the minds of managers to "work done". That's not easy for them, as some work has never actually involved any perceived "work done". Some employees are up to the task of self-motivation and suppression of distractions, and some aren't.
A family member who is conservative in all ways (not a fan of change) did not relish the idea when he got sent home to work like everyone else there during the PanicFest. He's gotten used to it well though, was told to stay away longer than most others due to his successful resistance to the vax mandate, but now got told he HAS to come in (on Tuesdays by one manager, Wednesday by another, so lets call it Tuesdays and Wednesdays). This place is not in downtown however. I'm not sure what will be their plan in the long run.
Remote work saves a LOT of money for rent and other overhead for businesses. True, there are plenty of white-collar jobs that must be done in an office somewhere that involve interfacing with reality. Where it can work I think remote work will continue, if not expand even.
If people aren't doing much working in offices downtown, will they still live there, in those converted former office buildings? I suppose one could work remotely from his condo in downtown too. You get out and about, if it's safe, hang out with other young people for lunch and dinner and the craft beer festival on that walk-street right about the corner... she lives on Pride Street ... lingers long on Pride Street... , got The Doors in my head...
Yeah, that's not so family friendly, as much as they think it is or WISH it would be.
The purpose of cities used to be serious industry a half-century ago, maybe more, but since then and before the internet allowed the type of interactions it does, it was to support company headquarters, government offices big entertainment venues, etc. Can a city be just a place for dense living with no other purpose? That would have been more possible if it hadn't been for the large increase in diversity and the experimentation with all the lefty weirdness that has made the street more miserable. Additionally, all this stupidity costs money. That may have been OK when tax money still poured into city coffers from the office towers. Can the residents alone support the stupidity that they must also live with? Family formation looks like a no-go item in these downtowns, affordable or otherwise. Better get away from the Bright Lights/Big City and back to those Subdivisions. Be cool or be cast out.
Cities have been around since Homo Sapiens began farming 100 centuries ago. Is their time over with? I only write about America here, but that's the way things are headed right now. I could be wrong.
PS: I didn't mention the factor of big universities in the cities. UConn has a small campus in West Hartford and a school of business in downtown, but the big campus is in Storrs, 22 miles to the east, a long way in Connecticut! There's an ~5,000 student Univ. of Hartford, but it's not a college town. Big university campuses can add life and money to a city. This is not so sustainable a business model either, as it's just based on more tax money. (No, not the State funds, but the school loan money coming from the taxpayers, the way it looks ...)
* Even this is going away. Water Department, power company, etc, offices have moved out of downtown, at least a little ways.
** I've always been a big Michael J. Fox fan. His sister Mallory was not too bad either!
*** In a rare style of Peak Stupidity brain fart, I'd written the 1st of those post 4 years before the 2nd one, and I'd totally forgotten by the 2nd. That's happened a few times over the 2,670 posts written.
**** Whatever happened to Andrew Yang, anyway?
Comments:
Moderator
Tuesday - July 25th 2023 8:07AM MST
PS: Excellent, Adam. It'll be lots easier to search for this stuff in that computer file than in the paper book - I'll give them that.
Peak Stupidity Book Club
Tuesday - July 25th 2023 6:32AM MST
PS: The Greatest Comeback (7MB .epub)
https://tinyurl.com/mu5jvn9p
☮
https://tinyurl.com/mu5jvn9p
☮
Moderator
Monday - July 24th 2023 7:48PM MST
PS: Mr. Hail, I am trying to remember the parts ijn "The Greatest Comeback" in which Pat Buchanan wrote about life in Washington FS in general. Unfortunately I don't have the book on me just now. I wrote thye review also a year or so after reading it, though I had it there for reference.
He lived in a different time - not just the politics themselves, but the difference in the civility of the politics. I think he still thinks it's like that, in Washington or somewhere ...
He lived in a different time - not just the politics themselves, but the difference in the civility of the politics. I think he still thinks it's like that, in Washington or somewhere ...
Hail
Monday - July 24th 2023 1:04PM MST
PS
-- (cont., on re-colonization of U.S. cities) --
I think Andrew Sullivan, the politically-interesting anti-Wokeness Gay-Liberal, originally of England, was also one of the re-colonizers of Washington around the 1990s.
Sullivan is a man who sings high praises of the USA in ways I find naive, but are interesting to hear anyway; he is a man hates Trump but also opposes ant-white Wokeness out of principle. He has been HIV-positive for years.
Andrew Sullivan is another frequent sparring partner with Steve Sailer. Steve Sailer long ago concluded Andrew Sullivan to be a serious man. And I do think he is another quintessential member of the recolonization of Washington by non-Blacks after the terrible few decades. These are not anchors to build communities on, of course, so the recolonization effort is now in semi-crisis with crime back up to near old levels, around triple the levels of the 2010s.
Steve Sailer said recently that he wasn't sure a single White-male had been murdered in Washington since 2016 with the mysterious Seth Rich murder; I replied that just in July 2023 there had been two White males murdered: One a visitor from Kentucky targeted for looking weak and scared; a second one a Nonbinary with a Jewish name.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/is-there-a-pattern-here/#comment-6068208
This is why it's so interesting to read old-timers' accounts of Washington (Pat Buchanan) as a normal, functional place with huge surfeit of LGBTQs, Jews, far-left ideologues, young-childless who are sure to move out when they start a family. I think some of those reminiscences of Pat Buchanan about the Washington he remembers are in the book about Nixon, reviewed here at Peak Stupidity about two years ago.
To bring it back to the original question: "What is the future of U.S. cities." A lot of cities have gone through a similar movement, and even in places like conservative Arkansas they have had success making (e.g.) a city like Fayetteville into a politically Blue hub. There are many places where this happens even without Diversity-immigration; but wherever Diversity-immigration happens there is a huge extra constituency that consolidates the whole.
One notable place similar movements have failed again and again: Detroit. I hear mixed things lately about that city. Some say it has, finally, had some success in morphing in that same direction. Others say it's an illusion. Time will tell.
-- (cont., on re-colonization of U.S. cities) --
I think Andrew Sullivan, the politically-interesting anti-Wokeness Gay-Liberal, originally of England, was also one of the re-colonizers of Washington around the 1990s.
Sullivan is a man who sings high praises of the USA in ways I find naive, but are interesting to hear anyway; he is a man hates Trump but also opposes ant-white Wokeness out of principle. He has been HIV-positive for years.
Andrew Sullivan is another frequent sparring partner with Steve Sailer. Steve Sailer long ago concluded Andrew Sullivan to be a serious man. And I do think he is another quintessential member of the recolonization of Washington by non-Blacks after the terrible few decades. These are not anchors to build communities on, of course, so the recolonization effort is now in semi-crisis with crime back up to near old levels, around triple the levels of the 2010s.
Steve Sailer said recently that he wasn't sure a single White-male had been murdered in Washington since 2016 with the mysterious Seth Rich murder; I replied that just in July 2023 there had been two White males murdered: One a visitor from Kentucky targeted for looking weak and scared; a second one a Nonbinary with a Jewish name.
https://www.unz.com/isteve/is-there-a-pattern-here/#comment-6068208
This is why it's so interesting to read old-timers' accounts of Washington (Pat Buchanan) as a normal, functional place with huge surfeit of LGBTQs, Jews, far-left ideologues, young-childless who are sure to move out when they start a family. I think some of those reminiscences of Pat Buchanan about the Washington he remembers are in the book about Nixon, reviewed here at Peak Stupidity about two years ago.
To bring it back to the original question: "What is the future of U.S. cities." A lot of cities have gone through a similar movement, and even in places like conservative Arkansas they have had success making (e.g.) a city like Fayetteville into a politically Blue hub. There are many places where this happens even without Diversity-immigration; but wherever Diversity-immigration happens there is a huge extra constituency that consolidates the whole.
One notable place similar movements have failed again and again: Detroit. I hear mixed things lately about that city. Some say it has, finally, had some success in morphing in that same direction. Others say it's an illusion. Time will tell.
Hail
Monday - July 24th 2023 12:51PM MST
PS
-- on Washington DC; and D. Kief's 1978 pass-through impressions --
Mr. Kief reminisces: "(In 1978), I visited the Yuppie-Parties' headquarters in D. C. - in downtown D. C. and was blown away by the ephemeral appearance that thing radiated - - but not only the office in dire straits - also the (mostly black) neighborhood: Auuh! - - And the staff - - - uhh - uhh--... leftovers with .v.e.r.y. low energy levels.."
I'm afraid to say that you visited Washington in its worst-ever period. That can be confidently stated for all its history, back to its founding (in 1790 or so by law in the U.S. constitution as a neutral-zone for the "U.S." government outside any State, but the area was settled some generations earlier and had its own history of European activity back to 1607/08 when the first Europeans visited.
Everything about Washington D.C. was "in dire straits" in the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s. By the 2000s, there were some real improvements beginning, but it didn't look like they could ever recover to the levels of the 1940s, 1950s, early 1960s (Pat Buchanan, b.1938, a native of Washington, speaks of how great the city was at the time).
The April 1968 riots destroyed parts of the city and induced most remaining Whites in most parts of the city to leave. Destroyed and damaged buildings were still easily visible in many neighborhoods during your 1978 visit, whether you noticed them or not or knew to look for them or not. And the dark cloud of an aggressive Black majority and an unwillingness of Whites or the state to assert themselves (Whites had fought back and defeated a previous Black riot in 1919/20 in the city), the dark cloud of 1968 remained many years. Crime had its long peak in the late 1960s to early 2000s. A typical U.S. city tragedy story.
In the 2010s, an interesting revival had occurred, although a one-party state dominated by Wokeness with a relatively low normal White population. (A typical example of the new type of resident was one of Steve Sailer's go-to commentators, Matthew Yglesias, who I think is Gay, Jewish, and with some kind of Hispanic ties).
The Corona-Panic of 2020, plus the political effects of Wokeness, hurt Washington again, and depending on who you ask it has either reverted to the 1990s or some point in the 2000s. There is a hardcore ideological element of some of the new population, but there remain very few White families. If two Whites with job/social ties to Washington, if they form a family, they leave Washington for a nearby place. This is true for many U.S. cities, of course.
-- on Washington DC; and D. Kief's 1978 pass-through impressions --
Mr. Kief reminisces: "(In 1978), I visited the Yuppie-Parties' headquarters in D. C. - in downtown D. C. and was blown away by the ephemeral appearance that thing radiated - - but not only the office in dire straits - also the (mostly black) neighborhood: Auuh! - - And the staff - - - uhh - uhh--... leftovers with .v.e.r.y. low energy levels.."
I'm afraid to say that you visited Washington in its worst-ever period. That can be confidently stated for all its history, back to its founding (in 1790 or so by law in the U.S. constitution as a neutral-zone for the "U.S." government outside any State, but the area was settled some generations earlier and had its own history of European activity back to 1607/08 when the first Europeans visited.
Everything about Washington D.C. was "in dire straits" in the 1970s, 1980s, and 1990s. By the 2000s, there were some real improvements beginning, but it didn't look like they could ever recover to the levels of the 1940s, 1950s, early 1960s (Pat Buchanan, b.1938, a native of Washington, speaks of how great the city was at the time).
The April 1968 riots destroyed parts of the city and induced most remaining Whites in most parts of the city to leave. Destroyed and damaged buildings were still easily visible in many neighborhoods during your 1978 visit, whether you noticed them or not or knew to look for them or not. And the dark cloud of an aggressive Black majority and an unwillingness of Whites or the state to assert themselves (Whites had fought back and defeated a previous Black riot in 1919/20 in the city), the dark cloud of 1968 remained many years. Crime had its long peak in the late 1960s to early 2000s. A typical U.S. city tragedy story.
In the 2010s, an interesting revival had occurred, although a one-party state dominated by Wokeness with a relatively low normal White population. (A typical example of the new type of resident was one of Steve Sailer's go-to commentators, Matthew Yglesias, who I think is Gay, Jewish, and with some kind of Hispanic ties).
The Corona-Panic of 2020, plus the political effects of Wokeness, hurt Washington again, and depending on who you ask it has either reverted to the 1990s or some point in the 2000s. There is a hardcore ideological element of some of the new population, but there remain very few White families. If two Whites with job/social ties to Washington, if they form a family, they leave Washington for a nearby place. This is true for many U.S. cities, of course.
Hail
Monday - July 24th 2023 12:26PM MST
PS
Mr. Kief says: "Mod's Hartford photographs are - plain spoken, so to speak. As is the Getty-Images stock-foto-comparison Hartford: Winterthur. No reason to theorize these, afaict."
What is the theorizing? That in the mid-20th century some drab office buildings were built, during the process of the "loss" of many U.S. cities (or, "as part of" that process, some will prefer to say)? There is no theory there. But it may miss something important.
The potential error would be as this one: A person on a long air-journey has a "lay-over" in Frankfurt, goes to the downtown business-district, and concludes that German landscape mainly had huge office towers and similar buildings.
Mr. Kief says: "Mod's Hartford photographs are - plain spoken, so to speak. As is the Getty-Images stock-foto-comparison Hartford: Winterthur. No reason to theorize these, afaict."
What is the theorizing? That in the mid-20th century some drab office buildings were built, during the process of the "loss" of many U.S. cities (or, "as part of" that process, some will prefer to say)? There is no theory there. But it may miss something important.
The potential error would be as this one: A person on a long air-journey has a "lay-over" in Frankfurt, goes to the downtown business-district, and concludes that German landscape mainly had huge office towers and similar buildings.
Dieter Kief
Monday - July 24th 2023 12:16PM MST
PS
Mod. - - only faint recollections of hot springs from '78, unfortunately. Its interesting what fades out and - what keeps up. Frto example. I visited the Yuppie-Parties' headwuarter in D. C. - in downtown D. C. and was blown away by the ephemeral appearance that thing radiated - - but not only the office in dire straits - also the (mostly black) neighborhood: Auuh! - - And the staff - - - uhh - uhh--... leftovers with .v.e.r.y. low energy levels...Also: We visited the conference of Humanistic Psychology in Toronto and - - - there too O got the impression to see something that - lacked behind, somehow. - Very funny: I found a way to sneek our way in (too long to explain how - - ) - but two rather bright and funny therapists, who owned (and flew) an airplane - looked through my maneuver (of which I made them - partners in this crime (hundred+ or so dollars for the two of us)) with - delight - and then went: Your grandfather must have been Jewish - - - - (my grandfather dealt with Jews and liked that and did tell me about his experiences - - - (heheh). I also LOVED the hip and down to earth & stylish Cow Café in Toronto. I wish I had made a shot of this one (I still have details of it in my head but wish I had more...).
Mr. Hail - - - Mod's Hartford photographs are - plain spoken, so to speak. As is the Getty-Images stock-foto-comparison Hartford: Winterthur. No reason to theorize these, afaict.
Mod. - - only faint recollections of hot springs from '78, unfortunately. Its interesting what fades out and - what keeps up. Frto example. I visited the Yuppie-Parties' headwuarter in D. C. - in downtown D. C. and was blown away by the ephemeral appearance that thing radiated - - but not only the office in dire straits - also the (mostly black) neighborhood: Auuh! - - And the staff - - - uhh - uhh--... leftovers with .v.e.r.y. low energy levels...Also: We visited the conference of Humanistic Psychology in Toronto and - - - there too O got the impression to see something that - lacked behind, somehow. - Very funny: I found a way to sneek our way in (too long to explain how - - ) - but two rather bright and funny therapists, who owned (and flew) an airplane - looked through my maneuver (of which I made them - partners in this crime (hundred+ or so dollars for the two of us)) with - delight - and then went: Your grandfather must have been Jewish - - - - (my grandfather dealt with Jews and liked that and did tell me about his experiences - - - (heheh). I also LOVED the hip and down to earth & stylish Cow Café in Toronto. I wish I had made a shot of this one (I still have details of it in my head but wish I had more...).
Mr. Hail - - - Mod's Hartford photographs are - plain spoken, so to speak. As is the Getty-Images stock-foto-comparison Hartford: Winterthur. No reason to theorize these, afaict.
Moderator
Monday - July 24th 2023 7:19AM MST
PS: Thanks for the very interesting comments, Mr. Kief and Mr. Hail, and Adam for the Detroit (I gotta assume!) "Ruin Porn".
Mr. Kief, that sounds like a grand tour you did 45 years back. I am glad you got to the Pacific Northwest, a favorite of mine. The Olympic Mountains are indeed a beautiful place for hiking (and the Cascades too). I wonder if the original Olympic Hot Springs were still in business, if you recall. There are the unofficial ones up a 2 mile trail - the upkeep is left to the hiker - keep rearranging the rocks.
Mr. Hail, I haven't read CF-Nation in a while. I should get back over there.
Mr. Kief, that sounds like a grand tour you did 45 years back. I am glad you got to the Pacific Northwest, a favorite of mine. The Olympic Mountains are indeed a beautiful place for hiking (and the Cascades too). I wonder if the original Olympic Hot Springs were still in business, if you recall. There are the unofficial ones up a 2 mile trail - the upkeep is left to the hiker - keep rearranging the rocks.
Mr. Hail, I haven't read CF-Nation in a while. I should get back over there.
Adam Smith
Sunday - July 23rd 2023 10:05PM MST
PS: Quick edit...
My Bad! Alexis on Fire is 𝐧𝐨𝐭 from London Ontario. They are from St. Catharines. But you get the idea...
On a happier note...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-5utHns0iU
Cheers!
☮
My Bad! Alexis on Fire is 𝐧𝐨𝐭 from London Ontario. They are from St. Catharines. But you get the idea...
On a happier note...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-5utHns0iU
Cheers!
☮
Adam Smith
Sunday - July 23rd 2023 9:47PM MST
PS: ☮
I stare in amazement...
I can't believe this is where I live...
https://youtu.be/IwOPi8uyI2M?t=15
https://i.ibb.co/pzRVdnr/01.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/1RbFRJf/02.png
https://i.ibb.co/bs8k734/03.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/wWPKZJZ/04.png
https://i.ibb.co/xSsJJhX/05.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/89v0b4r/06.png
https://i.ibb.co/dbXs24d/07.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/HrcSsmf/08.png
https://i.ibb.co/gWj5psb/09.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/SvqJ72H/10.png
https://i.ibb.co/3CQk5Bq/11.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/n7BZC5G/12.png
https://i.ibb.co/kQ0WWk0/13.jpg
☮
I stare in amazement...
I can't believe this is where I live...
https://youtu.be/IwOPi8uyI2M?t=15
https://i.ibb.co/pzRVdnr/01.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/1RbFRJf/02.png
https://i.ibb.co/bs8k734/03.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/wWPKZJZ/04.png
https://i.ibb.co/xSsJJhX/05.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/89v0b4r/06.png
https://i.ibb.co/dbXs24d/07.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/HrcSsmf/08.png
https://i.ibb.co/gWj5psb/09.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/SvqJ72H/10.png
https://i.ibb.co/3CQk5Bq/11.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/n7BZC5G/12.png
https://i.ibb.co/kQ0WWk0/13.jpg
☮
Adam Smith
Sunday - July 23rd 2023 9:03PM MST
PS: Happy evening, everyone,
“If one were to do a long-slow tour of formerly prosperous American cities and confined his experience of "what America is" to the impressions and experiences along that tour, and had to stay in such an America forevermore, he would be liable to become deeply depressed and maybe turn to hard drugs, or radical right-wing politics to get the enwords etc out.”
https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/forest-city-frowns-london-ranks-last-on-ranking-of-canadas-happiest-cities
https://youtu.be/IwOPi8uyI2M?t=15
☮
“If one were to do a long-slow tour of formerly prosperous American cities and confined his experience of "what America is" to the impressions and experiences along that tour, and had to stay in such an America forevermore, he would be liable to become deeply depressed and maybe turn to hard drugs, or radical right-wing politics to get the enwords etc out.”
https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/forest-city-frowns-london-ranks-last-on-ranking-of-canadas-happiest-cities
https://youtu.be/IwOPi8uyI2M?t=15
☮
Hail
Sunday - July 23rd 2023 5:53PM MST
PS
-- Future of 'cities'; J. H. Kunstler's view --
"Cities have been around since Homo Sapiens began farming 100 centuries ago. Is their time over with?"
This was a big topic in 2020 and 2021 by the prophets of the Panic, who envisioned a post-city, post-office, post-social-interaction world of pod-people who leave home occasionally to get the latest miracle vaccines (Leave the warmth of the pod for long periods, when I am not an Essential Worker? There are FLU VIRUSES out there; Are you crazy?).
There are obviously urbanized agglomerations ("metro areas," where you can drive to Wal-Mart to stock up on China's best, or is it just China's cheapest, soylent-products).
But you are referring specifically to urban-downtowns that we remember from a past era of train stations anchoring downtowns, main streets, people who could walk everywhere.
I don't think the "time" of the above-described is over with. I don't think you regularly read James Howard Kunstler (though I would recommend it; he often comes up with good material), but Kunstler has for many years talked about this problem or challenge. He is an interesting social critic, radical anti-Regime in his way, but he would identify the harmful effects of the Regime's domestic policies as in part being due to city design and car-culture (car-dependency and highways that undermine downtowns).
Kunstler these days preaches a vision of a small-scale "urban" future. Smaller towns but that are still defined by an urban concept in their center. But mega-cities defined by anomie, with layers of cheap-labor migrants, scheming migrants from the Orient and such, men-with-gold-chains running their various semi-scams, and a layer of Black and Hispanic subsidized-housing beneficiaries in Wokeness-funded buildings, and all the rest -- these things all don't have a future in Kunstler's view (although, as I read the Regime's goals, the Regime is committed to stretching the whole project out indefinitely). If that is what is being defined as a "city," it's tougher to imagine a strong future, once the money-rivers of Wokeness dry up.
-- Future of 'cities'; J. H. Kunstler's view --
"Cities have been around since Homo Sapiens began farming 100 centuries ago. Is their time over with?"
This was a big topic in 2020 and 2021 by the prophets of the Panic, who envisioned a post-city, post-office, post-social-interaction world of pod-people who leave home occasionally to get the latest miracle vaccines (Leave the warmth of the pod for long periods, when I am not an Essential Worker? There are FLU VIRUSES out there; Are you crazy?).
There are obviously urbanized agglomerations ("metro areas," where you can drive to Wal-Mart to stock up on China's best, or is it just China's cheapest, soylent-products).
But you are referring specifically to urban-downtowns that we remember from a past era of train stations anchoring downtowns, main streets, people who could walk everywhere.
I don't think the "time" of the above-described is over with. I don't think you regularly read James Howard Kunstler (though I would recommend it; he often comes up with good material), but Kunstler has for many years talked about this problem or challenge. He is an interesting social critic, radical anti-Regime in his way, but he would identify the harmful effects of the Regime's domestic policies as in part being due to city design and car-culture (car-dependency and highways that undermine downtowns).
Kunstler these days preaches a vision of a small-scale "urban" future. Smaller towns but that are still defined by an urban concept in their center. But mega-cities defined by anomie, with layers of cheap-labor migrants, scheming migrants from the Orient and such, men-with-gold-chains running their various semi-scams, and a layer of Black and Hispanic subsidized-housing beneficiaries in Wokeness-funded buildings, and all the rest -- these things all don't have a future in Kunstler's view (although, as I read the Regime's goals, the Regime is committed to stretching the whole project out indefinitely). If that is what is being defined as a "city," it's tougher to imagine a strong future, once the money-rivers of Wokeness dry up.
Hail
Sunday - July 23rd 2023 5:10PM MST
PS
-- On travel, the magic of the New Place, and the Uncanny Valley --
There is a magic in an initial contact with a place, one of the part of life we don't have any satisfactory scientific answer, IMO. And equally funny is the the human mind has a funny trick of losing the magic after a certain period. It's not often one can keep that enchanted feeling very long. And chasing it is what motivates lots of the hardcore perennial long-distance travelers you'll encounter out there.
Having observed this New Place Magic phenomenon so often, one tends to develop the personal admonition: Write down impressions! The former custom of descriptive letter-writing to the "folks back home" (really a great art, in its time) was an excellent way to capture the magic. The magic does NOT have to be positive. More often it is positive than not.
Photography virtually always fails to capture the New Place Magic phenomenon. (I wonder what Mr. Kief --- who is a talented artistic photographer, as shown on his popular pictures in the "Twitter-verse" --- thinks of that.) At its best, photography may still most often be capturing something else than the same magic you experience. So photography is ironically, like art! (Ironic because photography is literally supposed to be an exact duplicate of reality.) Photography is subject to the viewer's interpretation.
There are probably many different types of this New Place Magic. One kind is when a place is similar enough to what the encounterer knows, but different enough to notice. Familiar but novel. When Mr. Kief has written on these pages in the past of positive impressions of the USA, and when others of Mother Europe say similar things, I imagine this phenomenon is at work. Classic America is absolutely a product of Europe, and so much is familiar at a baseline level that the unfamiliar gets wrapped in magic. But the same happens the other way around, for the White-American sojourner who "returns" to Mother Europe for a time (especially if treating the task spiritually, as many do). I guess this applies to Mr. Alarmist, who has made much of his adult life in parts of Europe.
People talk about the "Uncanny Valley" phenomenon and the risks of flooding the world with things produced by "algorithm" bots (slickly-marketed as "A.I.") --- texts, images to include "art," and certainly even videos now --- as being harmful to the human spirit. I agree with these critics. But the "Uncanny Valley," whatever its cause in human psychology, could also be a positive, WHEN you know what you are seeing is real (to the extent we know anything is 'real').
Let me recapitulate the little argument I've tried to develop here with this thought-experiment: The European sojourner in North America who experiences the forms of New Place magic that often arise, the same phenomenon would not hold in a totally-post-European portion of the USA. The scenes from Blade Runner depicted a dark vision of a post-White, techno-dystopic Los Angeles of the 2020s. It's not likely any White-European visitor would have any positive reaction to such a place, not in the way he gets from classic North America, or places such as Australia and New Zealand .
(By the way, speaking of Australia and New Zealand: They are hosting the women's World Cup of Soccer right now, and as ethno-cultural study it's fascinating to watch it, I am a little surprised to admit. I may have more to say on this at a future date.)
-- On travel, the magic of the New Place, and the Uncanny Valley --
There is a magic in an initial contact with a place, one of the part of life we don't have any satisfactory scientific answer, IMO. And equally funny is the the human mind has a funny trick of losing the magic after a certain period. It's not often one can keep that enchanted feeling very long. And chasing it is what motivates lots of the hardcore perennial long-distance travelers you'll encounter out there.
Having observed this New Place Magic phenomenon so often, one tends to develop the personal admonition: Write down impressions! The former custom of descriptive letter-writing to the "folks back home" (really a great art, in its time) was an excellent way to capture the magic. The magic does NOT have to be positive. More often it is positive than not.
Photography virtually always fails to capture the New Place Magic phenomenon. (I wonder what Mr. Kief --- who is a talented artistic photographer, as shown on his popular pictures in the "Twitter-verse" --- thinks of that.) At its best, photography may still most often be capturing something else than the same magic you experience. So photography is ironically, like art! (Ironic because photography is literally supposed to be an exact duplicate of reality.) Photography is subject to the viewer's interpretation.
There are probably many different types of this New Place Magic. One kind is when a place is similar enough to what the encounterer knows, but different enough to notice. Familiar but novel. When Mr. Kief has written on these pages in the past of positive impressions of the USA, and when others of Mother Europe say similar things, I imagine this phenomenon is at work. Classic America is absolutely a product of Europe, and so much is familiar at a baseline level that the unfamiliar gets wrapped in magic. But the same happens the other way around, for the White-American sojourner who "returns" to Mother Europe for a time (especially if treating the task spiritually, as many do). I guess this applies to Mr. Alarmist, who has made much of his adult life in parts of Europe.
People talk about the "Uncanny Valley" phenomenon and the risks of flooding the world with things produced by "algorithm" bots (slickly-marketed as "A.I.") --- texts, images to include "art," and certainly even videos now --- as being harmful to the human spirit. I agree with these critics. But the "Uncanny Valley," whatever its cause in human psychology, could also be a positive, WHEN you know what you are seeing is real (to the extent we know anything is 'real').
Let me recapitulate the little argument I've tried to develop here with this thought-experiment: The European sojourner in North America who experiences the forms of New Place magic that often arise, the same phenomenon would not hold in a totally-post-European portion of the USA. The scenes from Blade Runner depicted a dark vision of a post-White, techno-dystopic Los Angeles of the 2020s. It's not likely any White-European visitor would have any positive reaction to such a place, not in the way he gets from classic North America, or places such as Australia and New Zealand .
(By the way, speaking of Australia and New Zealand: They are hosting the women's World Cup of Soccer right now, and as ethno-cultural study it's fascinating to watch it, I am a little surprised to admit. I may have more to say on this at a future date.)
Dieter Kief
Sunday - July 23rd 2023 12:45AM MST
PS
Mod. - the big thing in Detroit in '78 was the brand new Ranaissance Center - - - some posh towers and sourrounding buildings at the waterfront - - - we once went there for dinner - - it was nice, but not the least bit convincing; so its name already then sounded - hollow/empty/pompouspreposterous - also a bot comical for those who knew ab it about renaissance Italy...
Except for that Mod.I hitchhiked mostly alone, but traveled also with my then US girlfriend and her family to visit friends and family.
From the top of my head: Los Angeles, Las Vegas, San Francisco, Washington state, (and Washington D. C.) - - , also went hiking in Washington state; then we visited this freak city in Oregon - - - Eugene (super nice!); Bozeman, Glacier Mountain N'tl Park, Disneyland (for anthropological study reasons-... - ok a part-joke: I wanted to see how that works - the overall friendliness was what stuck out - WE ARE NICE & WARM), Minnesota, Milwaukee, Flint and other places around there, the Upper Peninsula, Toronto; also a super-charming little farm I stayed for a while near Flint, that a chemist with six kids and his very nice wife ran (scandinavian/irish couple) - - -they had a 35 hp Massey Ferguson (the red model I like best!) - and some of their daughters were utterly uncomplicated, charming, bright, fit etc. - - - just pure sunshine as was the little son Joey (six years old). I went out to hunt garbage snakes etc. with him - - - I visited Raleigh, the Appalachian Trail, rural North Carolina (the people!!), I had dinner with a rich guy who ran a construction business, who picked me up on the road and we talked road- and construction-work what he liked! - He then rang up his friend, a republican member of congress (English name - can't recall it) who had an impressive 19th century farm-house nar Raleigh (more like a little castle with a long driveway that led up to it and so on and he was proud, that he could use the house without air condition (they had a pond and (big) oak-trees around the house etc...).
He also was quite knowledgeable with literature and - the work of Robert Altman (we talked about some of his films and Bob Dylan (who had just put out Street Ltegal)). I was really scratching my head that such a family would have lunch at Wendy's - but they did - with the kids and their cleaning lady - - - . I was at Cape Hatteras for some time, in Gary / Indiana (oh boy) and a few weeks in hot June in New York City in a fourth story railroad flat near Columbia University. Somebody put the best collection of Rilke poems that there is on the stairs for pick up - I took it: Ed. by McIntyre, I still have it - within reach! - - Clubs were cheap. Live music nothing too impressive for me coming from Heidelberg, the Kinks played a run down lookin' concert hall I took a rather scenic photo of and the museums were great. I lived with a 40y-ish woman who could have been the role-model for Madonna and her more 25-ish Brit boyfriend. They were nice and all and did show me around and were very open and proud about their rich sex-life, which struck me as a bit - - -you know: Uneasy and - - zeitgeist-forced. I've left out other national parks, Denver and Colorado, some midwestern stretches that were not too impressive - - except the trailer that was taken up into the air during a tornado and thrown wide and afar amidst roaring dust. We watched from a delivery truck under a bridge. I spent spring, summer and early fall in the US.
Mod. - the big thing in Detroit in '78 was the brand new Ranaissance Center - - - some posh towers and sourrounding buildings at the waterfront - - - we once went there for dinner - - it was nice, but not the least bit convincing; so its name already then sounded - hollow/empty/pompouspreposterous - also a bot comical for those who knew ab it about renaissance Italy...
Except for that Mod.I hitchhiked mostly alone, but traveled also with my then US girlfriend and her family to visit friends and family.
From the top of my head: Los Angeles, Las Vegas, San Francisco, Washington state, (and Washington D. C.) - - , also went hiking in Washington state; then we visited this freak city in Oregon - - - Eugene (super nice!); Bozeman, Glacier Mountain N'tl Park, Disneyland (for anthropological study reasons-... - ok a part-joke: I wanted to see how that works - the overall friendliness was what stuck out - WE ARE NICE & WARM), Minnesota, Milwaukee, Flint and other places around there, the Upper Peninsula, Toronto; also a super-charming little farm I stayed for a while near Flint, that a chemist with six kids and his very nice wife ran (scandinavian/irish couple) - - -they had a 35 hp Massey Ferguson (the red model I like best!) - and some of their daughters were utterly uncomplicated, charming, bright, fit etc. - - - just pure sunshine as was the little son Joey (six years old). I went out to hunt garbage snakes etc. with him - - - I visited Raleigh, the Appalachian Trail, rural North Carolina (the people!!), I had dinner with a rich guy who ran a construction business, who picked me up on the road and we talked road- and construction-work what he liked! - He then rang up his friend, a republican member of congress (English name - can't recall it) who had an impressive 19th century farm-house nar Raleigh (more like a little castle with a long driveway that led up to it and so on and he was proud, that he could use the house without air condition (they had a pond and (big) oak-trees around the house etc...).
He also was quite knowledgeable with literature and - the work of Robert Altman (we talked about some of his films and Bob Dylan (who had just put out Street Ltegal)). I was really scratching my head that such a family would have lunch at Wendy's - but they did - with the kids and their cleaning lady - - - . I was at Cape Hatteras for some time, in Gary / Indiana (oh boy) and a few weeks in hot June in New York City in a fourth story railroad flat near Columbia University. Somebody put the best collection of Rilke poems that there is on the stairs for pick up - I took it: Ed. by McIntyre, I still have it - within reach! - - Clubs were cheap. Live music nothing too impressive for me coming from Heidelberg, the Kinks played a run down lookin' concert hall I took a rather scenic photo of and the museums were great. I lived with a 40y-ish woman who could have been the role-model for Madonna and her more 25-ish Brit boyfriend. They were nice and all and did show me around and were very open and proud about their rich sex-life, which struck me as a bit - - -you know: Uneasy and - - zeitgeist-forced. I've left out other national parks, Denver and Colorado, some midwestern stretches that were not too impressive - - except the trailer that was taken up into the air during a tornado and thrown wide and afar amidst roaring dust. We watched from a delivery truck under a bridge. I spent spring, summer and early fall in the US.
Moderator
Saturday - July 22nd 2023 10:01PM MST
PS: Mr. Kief, can you tell us some other places you visited in America in '1978? I'd like to know what your impression was of some other locales.
I don't know when they stopped touting Detroit as the "Paris of the West". It must have been in the late 1950s.
I don't know when they stopped touting Detroit as the "Paris of the West". It must have been in the late 1950s.
Dieter Kief
Saturday - July 22nd 2023 3:03PM MST
PS
PS
Mr. Hail - - -you have been the one to set the blues-tone - - I kept that up and went for it - - - loking at what "Achmed" showed us- - -and what you see on the Getty stock-photos from Hartford. Compare these with the Getty-stock-photos from Winterthur - and I chose Winterthur because it is looked upon as the .l.e.a.s.t. attractive of the bigger Swiss cities - - - compare these two and - you're blow away by the difference, I'd hold. I know that there are old buildings in Hartford too - - - but look at the broader picture the stock-photo collection gives you - - -. Btw. - - there is something abandoned in lots of the older buldings too. And yes - - - a lack of people plays into the cards here too - - but it is more than that: It's that the city itself seems to have abandoned them. Dominated is the city by buildings, roads and streets that are in large parts out of proportion (no human measure...). As I said: While sailing down the Hudson River to New York City, Robert M. Persig,as my guide, so to speak, registered this inner and outer decay in a landscape nearby and - - - from Mod.'s photos and from the Getty-stock-photos: Hartford seems to echo Robert M.Pirsig's observations - - - quite well-.
My heart sinks and I'm glad that I don't live in such a place. btw. - - I spent some time in Detroit and had this sinkin' feelin' there too (this was in 1978 - but from what I hear, the situation has not changed much for the better - - - and it was mighty awful. - Not totally unpleasant - also not absolutely without a crude (very crude...***) charme - - - So: Hartford will carry on for decades to come - - and what's beyond this curtain, nobody knows - - . But Robert M. Pirsigs observatin about the lack of - - - quality aged very well, it seems to me. To repeat myself: His Zen novel and Laila are books of great insights and diagnostical skills.
***for example we lived in a house downtown Detroit - a villa in a park - and the gang members who - - -had taken over this park - declared that we whities could stay, but- - HAD to leave our doors unlocked. They also came to make "cool" inspections - - - surreally hot summer experiences...
PS
Mr. Hail - - -you have been the one to set the blues-tone - - I kept that up and went for it - - - loking at what "Achmed" showed us- - -and what you see on the Getty stock-photos from Hartford. Compare these with the Getty-stock-photos from Winterthur - and I chose Winterthur because it is looked upon as the .l.e.a.s.t. attractive of the bigger Swiss cities - - - compare these two and - you're blow away by the difference, I'd hold. I know that there are old buildings in Hartford too - - - but look at the broader picture the stock-photo collection gives you - - -. Btw. - - there is something abandoned in lots of the older buldings too. And yes - - - a lack of people plays into the cards here too - - but it is more than that: It's that the city itself seems to have abandoned them. Dominated is the city by buildings, roads and streets that are in large parts out of proportion (no human measure...). As I said: While sailing down the Hudson River to New York City, Robert M. Persig,as my guide, so to speak, registered this inner and outer decay in a landscape nearby and - - - from Mod.'s photos and from the Getty-stock-photos: Hartford seems to echo Robert M.Pirsig's observations - - - quite well-.
My heart sinks and I'm glad that I don't live in such a place. btw. - - I spent some time in Detroit and had this sinkin' feelin' there too (this was in 1978 - but from what I hear, the situation has not changed much for the better - - - and it was mighty awful. - Not totally unpleasant - also not absolutely without a crude (very crude...***) charme - - - So: Hartford will carry on for decades to come - - and what's beyond this curtain, nobody knows - - . But Robert M. Pirsigs observatin about the lack of - - - quality aged very well, it seems to me. To repeat myself: His Zen novel and Laila are books of great insights and diagnostical skills.
***for example we lived in a house downtown Detroit - a villa in a park - and the gang members who - - -had taken over this park - declared that we whities could stay, but- - HAD to leave our doors unlocked. They also came to make "cool" inspections - - - surreally hot summer experiences...